The Creative Business Forum, by TAVO Media Group
The Creative Business Forum is a weekly business podcast, hosted by Bryant Walker, Founder & CEO of TAVO Media Group. The Creative Business Forum welcomes business owners, leaders and innovators from around the world to share more about their professional and personal challenges, ideas, skips and leaps throughout their careers, while also striving to develop and implement creative-solutions to everyday and not-so-everyday challenges.
Learn more about TAVO Media Group by visiting https://tavomediagroup.com
The Creative Business Forum, by TAVO Media Group
Unlocking Marketing Potential in Niche Industries with Eric Bursano
Picture this: you've crafted a killer marketing strategy, but you're still not reaching your target audience. What's going wrong? Could the solution be as simple as adjusting your timing or leveraging overlooked platforms like Google Maps? Our guest, Eric Bursano from Market my Market, thinks so. In our conversation, he unravels the unique challenges of marketing within niche industries such as the legal, healthcare, and moving & storage sectors. He emphasizes the importance of seizing the right moment to engage potential clients, especially on social media platforms.
Struggling with OTT? Eric shares fascinating insights about the downside of Over-The-Top services like Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon Prime, particularly in terms of attribution. Don't sweat, though, as we also explore the strategies to overcome these challenges and the role TV plays in creating brand awareness. Additionally, we dissect the power of targeting and segmentation in advertising. Eric makes a compelling case for a cost-effective approach, focusing laser-sharp on a specific audience for substantial benefits.
The episode wraps up with a deep dive into the evolution of legal marketing strategies. Eric highlights the crucial role of diversifying the marketing mix, understanding the audience, and gathering feedback through focus groups. If you are intrigued by marketing in niche sectors or eager to polish your marketing strategy, you will find our chat with Eric Bursano of Market my Market incredibly beneficial. It's packed with actionable tips that could revolutionize your marketing approach. So, prepare to challenge your thinking and redefine your marketing strategy with us!
The Creative Business Forum is produced by TAVO Media Group and is intended as a forum to highlight, spotlight and showcase cross-industry leaders and innovators with a story to tell. We share and celebrate their journey and encourage our listeners and followers to engage with our guests, support their brands and share their stories. We're building our community and want you to be a part of it!
To learn more about TAVO's agency services, please visit our website: TAVOMediaGroup.com
Hey guys, this is Bright Walker with the Creative Business Forum here for another episode of Marketing how To's and Talking Shop Today with Eric Bursano of Market my Market, a full service agency, and we're going to talk shop, dive into a few things and share some more stories about what works, what does it and the world of marketing, advertising and just all things business. Eric, thank you for hopping on today.
Speaker 2:I appreciate it Absolutely, Brian. Thanks for the invitation. Glad to be here. Yeah, of course.
Speaker 1:So let's talk about Market, my Market. What do you guys do? What are the types of clients you work with? And we'll go from there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so Market. My Market is a full service agency, but we have a couple of niches that we've pared down to. I personally work in the legal space, so we work with mostly, I'd say, one to five partner law firms anywhere in the United States and just about any practice area. Most of them are consumer facing, though, so that would be personal injury, family law, criminal defense, employment are really kind of the wheelhouse, although we do work with some estate planning attorneys and business attorneys as well and then we have another side of the house that really focuses more on the healthcare side, so that would be dentists. We've got clients that do spine surgeries and have spine centers set up, and then another small niche we have would be moving at storage. So not a ton of those businesses out there, but the marketing and number of different locations that these moving at storage places have is pretty impressive.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and we were talking a little bit before hopping on. It's interesting how some of these industries that you wouldn't necessarily think are big markets for us to go after and our respective spaces of advertising marketing are actually pretty large and significant and their needs are just as great as any other brand. What are some of the challenges that? I guess we'll talk about storage as an example. What are some of the challenges they come to you with that you guys can help solve?
Speaker 2:Well, storage, almost like the legal industry, is something you don't need until you need it. It's not like everybody's looking for a new pair of shoes every six months or so. So the key to that is being in front of your target audience when they need you. And how do you find that out? What are some of those key indicators? So one of the things that we do is we look for some of those tall tail signs.
Speaker 2:Social media is a tremendous asset to that, because what do people start doing before they move? Well, they might go to Zillow or Redfin, they'll do some different searches, they might go to a furniture shop or they might be selling things to get rid of things before that move. So being able to be on TV, cable, social media is great, but if you can't pare down that potential audience to know who's really most going to be receptive to your message, then you're wasting a lot of those dollars. So a lot of it is trying to really hyper focus our clients and get them in front of the people who need their services at that time.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. I mean, there's so much opportunities really, when you think about the broader set of businesses that are really untapped when it comes to what agencies typically go after. And, admittedly, it's not the sexy brands necessarily that help us build our respective businesses, but their needs, like we said, are just as great. We talked a little bit about OTT and Connected TV. How are you guys using that for some of your clients, regardless of industry?
Speaker 2:Sure, great question. One other thing I wanted to mention on the moving in storage, which also relates to our other practices, would be Google Maps. This one thing that I think people have overlooked for a long time, and all the research shows that when Google Maps shows up those three listings, that map pack, that area gets clicked on more than anywhere else. So about 20% to 30% of the clicks will be on paid search when it shows up and about 20% to 30% of the clicks will be in the organic, the upper half of the first page. Anybody on page two is basically invisible. But because that map section is so dynamic it's in color, it shows your reviews, it shows directions, it has links to your website, it talks about your services and your business hours. That is a magnet for clicks.
Speaker 2:So we've actually built our own in-house team. We took somebody from a really big, well-known company. That that's all he concentrated on. We let him build a team within Market my Market to only focus on Google Maps. So something I didn't want to pass over, because I think it's a strategy whether you're a hair salon or whether you've got a pet grooming business, anything that's localized don't ignore that. Google Maps get reviews. But onto OTT, which I-.
Speaker 1:No, I mean honestly, I wouldn't mind is peeling back that layer or pulling that. For that more because it's a great call-out. There's plenty of time to talk about OTT and connected TV. We have the whole future for that. I mean Google Maps.
Speaker 1:It's funny because, again, we talk about some of these tactics that are not necessarily the most exciting, but they are impactful. It's what, to your point, it stands out when people are looking for things, it is in addition to or aside from organic or paid search results. You got full color, you've got directions, you got all these things and Google Maps and just Google listings in general. I'm sure you guys get this and I get them all the time. All these Autobots, spam dialer calls like, oh, your Google listing is out of date. I'm like, no, actually it's not dude, but it's a recording that I'm speaking to and I'm wasting my breath. So how do you, when you're building the business and have these conversations with business owners, I mean, are they receptive to that call out or do you, in other words, you approach it as a standalone service or is that just one thing that you guys kind of elevate as part of the broader service package?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great question, and the one thing that I love about Google Maps is you don't have to explain an esoteric thing like link building. You don't have to talk about foundational SEO and H1 tags. There's tools out there. One of the tools we use is called local Falcon and what I can do is I can put your business in there. Let's just say we'll take a pizza shop, I can put your pizza shop in there and let's say you're in the middle of New York City and I can do pizza near me, and I can show you where you rank in the map pack, not only at your front door, but within a four, five or 10 mile radius. Now if that map lights up red, you're in trouble. That means that you're not in the map pack anywhere. But you'll see ones and twos and threes and anytime you're a three or lower, that means you're in the map pack.
Speaker 2:And if I can take a client, say a personal injury attorney, and I can get them to go from 500 yards outside of their office to four miles for a term like car accident lawyer, I've just changed their life because take even a city like Omaha if I can get a four or five mile range. I'm hitting hundreds of thousands of people. It could be 200,000 people just with that one location. The other thing is if you're in a really high, you know a dense market that has very high value services like a dentist, like oral surgeon, like a lawyer, opening up a second practice, just like a franchise for Starbucks or McDonald's, gives you a whole nother asset to optimize. So I like talking about it because it's intrinsic. You tell somebody about it, their eyes open up, as opposed to the typical SEO conversation, which gets a little bit more complex and into the weeds.
Speaker 1:Right? No, I didn't mean to interrupt you before, but I think what's unique about it to kind of the broader picture of painting is the map itself is tangible. You can have that conversation with a prospect or a client and it's a very tangible thing to be able to look at. When it's tangible in a digital sense anyways, but you can see it, you can touch it, you can interact with it, and you can't do that with, like you said, back links, another SEO juju. That is really something that clients don't care about. Businesses don't care about that stuff. It's show me the result and this is something that you take. I mean, what is the turnaround time for me to be able to optimize someone's Google map pack?
Speaker 2:That's another good question, so that it's usually about three months from the day that we start working on it, which sounds like a long time to the average person, but in the SEO world that's about the soonest in a really weak market.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you start to see this. And the cool thing about these maps is we take timestamps. So I know you can't see me right now and I'm talking with my hands, but if you can picture five square blocks around your business whatever that is and you ranking in that and then you see, a month later you're ranking 10 blocks and then three months later you're ranking a mile and then six months later, that is something that, as you mentioned, is tangible and you'll notice it and, as a marketer, you already know this. But being able to track clicks from your Google my Business, calls from your Google my Business if you're not tracking it, you're only guessing. So, with our clients, we'll tell you whether it's an organic visitor, whether they came from Google my Business, whether it was a direct search or a paid search. So being able to fractionalize your visitors and go, wow, 10 months ago we were getting two or three visitors from our maps and now we're getting 30. That's tangible, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:It's remarkable, really. And to your point, yeah, I do spend a fair amount of time talking to clients and prospects alike just to remind them that, look, a campaign takes time. Any effort that's worth doing takes a little bit of time. And you're right, three months in the grand scheme of a master campaign and growing a business that hopefully will be around for years to come, three months is a drop in the timeline bucket. So let's just be patient. Be patient everybody. It takes time.
Speaker 1:So let's go ahead and pivot to OTT and Connected TV. I'm excited by it. We've been testing a few different platforms. We talked about Hulu earlier before we started recording as well, and we're experimenting in the Disney bubble that is Hulu advertising, and it's interesting. We're seeing some different results for different clients and experimenting. But I do like the idea of experimenting on a relatively new platform. But what's your experience been like and how are some of the clients that you're working with seeing some of those results come through?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So first of all, for anybody who's not familiar with OTT or CTV, that is, you know if you're watching a sports game on your ESPN app or you've got a CNN app or you're watching Hulu or Sling or YouTube TV, last year we passed the threshold of over 50% of people are now connected to TT or OTT, so the competitor of that would be Cable and Broadcast, which everybody's familiar with. Now Cable and Broadcast offer, you know, historical value to them, but there is nothing that's going to compare to the targeting ability of OTT and CTV. And what I mean by that is you know, if I gave you two shows, if I said you know there's Monday Night Football and then there's the Kardashians, you and I both know that there's a typical audience that's going to watch those, but I don't know exactly who's watching that Monday Night Football or the Kardashians. When we do CTV or OTT, because you're streaming and because there's a pixel that's attached to you, I know how old you are, what gender you are, I know probably how you vote, what your credit story is, whether you're a home owner or not, and now I can serve really targeted ads to you.
Speaker 2:So I'll give you a quick example. That's kind of eye-opening. We deal with some legal campaigns. That would be insurance bad faith. So Hurricane rolls into Florida, knocks over a bunch of homes and a lot of times the insurance companies don't want to pay what they owe. So why would I run a TV campaign for that entire affected area when I can only target homeowners? Or I can target homeowners that own million dollar homes or above, or a million or less. So the ability to target means that you're spending your marketing dollars on your audience and not wasting it on people who aren't.
Speaker 1:And you can be laser focused.
Speaker 1:That's one of the things that I like about it is we've worked with clients in the healthcare sector as well as in sports and active lifestyle sector, and whether their budget is $500,000 or $5,000 or even a thousand, we could spend a thousand bucks targeting a few very specific people you made a point earlier we were talking.
Speaker 1:It's very similar to direct mail in that regard, but obviously way more sophisticated. But the fact that you can segment with a certain degree of accuracy based on demographic data and you may not see exactly your advertising to. There's still that metadata gap where we can't see them. There should be some privacy laws in place, but we know with some degree of accuracy we're targeting some very specific demos with our ads and be able to attract and engage with a different audience. That we couldn't get to before with a smaller budget, with some of these clients have, and it's a great building block to be able to expand upon and it gives us on the creative side, we can do more stuff and create more content that will see the light of day and not just live in the Instagram bubble.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you just hit on the other side of the coin that I didn't cover. So the targeting is one huge advantage of OTT, but the laser focused geography is the other. So with cable and broadcast, new York is the best example. Because if I want to advertise in Westchester, new York, I have to buy the DMA for Manhattan. You can't do that. That doesn't make sense because that's where they're broadcasting to. You have to go everybody who's lumped in there.
Speaker 2:Now take the in opposite situation. If I'm in Manhattan, I want to advertise. I don't want to advertise to all the boroughs in Westchester. But with OTT I can target two zip codes and still probably hit a quarter of a million people. So you can target where people are. So a pizza shop in Manhattan doesn't want to advertise in SoHo and in lower Manhattan and everything in between. So what you do is you pick out your backyard and you become the 800 pound gorilla in your backyard. Because in a lot of industries you've got that 800 pound gorilla, whether it's in legal or whether it's in storage, and this gives you the ability to really focus and target on a budget that you can afford.
Speaker 1:Okay, so we're talking about connected TV, we're talking about demographics and targeting, and it all sounds exciting. What sort of data are you getting as a result of some of these campaigns in some of these markets for some of the clients that you're working with currently?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great question, and before everybody goes to their checkbooks and starts writing all their budget towards OTT, I'll say that there's somewhat of a downside to it as well. So the downside is attribution, and what that means is TV is typically an awareness medium. That means you're hitting somebody while they're watching Monday Night Football. They were recently in an accident or they're planning on getting the wisdom teeth out, and now you've reminded them. Now, the thing is they don't necessarily pick up the phone right there in the middle of the game and call you, but they might write your number down or they might remember your address, or they might just do a Google search and look for you the next day. So there's a few ways that you can track people. I always say put a custom tracking phone number on any separate mediums that you're doing. We'll actually put QR codes on these so people can scan it with their phone. And the one thing people don't know is OTT. 95% of the people who are watching OTT are watching it on the biggest screen in their house. This isn't people watching things on their mobile phone. Now, the advantage is you've typically got more of a captured audience. The disadvantage is they can't walk up the TV and click a button and go to your website. So putting a QR code, leaving your website, putting a tracking number is on there. So that's all very important, but what we have to do is we have to measure other types of things to generalize what effect it's having.
Speaker 2:That is a lift to your website. So you are historically getting 500 visitors. You started OTT. Now you're averaging 800 visitors. We can attribute some of that.
Speaker 2:How many more branded searches are you getting? Because, the truth be told, not a ton of people are gonna call that tracking number. You're gonna get some, but what we wanna do is run more OTT if it's working and stop doing it if it's not. So we're gonna use all of the measurement tools that we have access to. One of them that's really cool that the average person might know is we all have kind of a digital social security number online. So we all, and one of the things we can do is we can put a pixel. So I know that Bryant saw my OTT commercial and that a day later went to my website. I can make that connection now. So there's pixels that you can put on both of those. Now we can actually track that lift.
Speaker 2:So I don't wanna tell you how do you feel OTT's going. I wanna say here's how many ads we delivered, here's how many impressions and the frequency we got. Here's the lift that we can attribute it to because of this pixel. How are the phones? Are you getting people that said that they saw it? Is there anything that we can with 100% certainty track, meaning the phone number or QR code? So there's a real, real positive side to OTT. And then, on the downside, it's not always what we call attributable, because you never know why someone called. Was it because they saw three year commercials and then did a Google search for you? Or did they call directly from the commercial?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that brings up I mean I compare TV advertising. I put that in the same bucket as out of home or billboards for those listening. It's. No one's gonna call your phone number while they're driving on the freeway. Sure, they're stuck in traffic. They might see your billboard for a bit longer than they would otherwise when they're speeding down the highway. But the same is true for TV and a lot of times they're watching they're not focused on your ad 24, seven and in most cases your ad comes on or there's a commercial break. They see little ticker in the corner that there's 60 seconds left of an ad or of a commercial break. That's their restroom break, just like it is with traditional broadcast TV.
Speaker 1:So, having those tools being able to show the throughput of out of all the ads that ran for that spend and all the impressions you got right, what does that lift? Where is the attribution, where's the throughput? Where's that connection? But it's never a closed loop when it comes to this stuff. It's not like direct response ads or just running rather digital ads, online and programmatic and all that stuff. It's one slice of the pie. And that brings me to, I guess, reporting and tracking. I mean just talking shop. Are there dashboards or platforms that you like to use either for your team internally, or dashboards that you like to review and share with the clients and show them visually how things are working?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we have a third party platform that plugs everything in. That means, if I get, I'm going to pull in everything from your web traffic to your organic leads to your paid leads. If you've got a billboard and we don't do billboards if you've got a billboard with a tracking number, we'll put your tracking number in there and we'll label it billboard, so you can see all the activity that comes from your billboard. Ott is a separate platform because it's just the different. As you just mentioned, it's really it's an awareness medium, it's a branding medium. It can act as a quasi direct response in some cases if you hit the right person at the exact right time.
Speaker 2:But you're looking at different metrics there. You're looking at impressions, you're looking at geography served. You're looking at, as you mentioned before, hulu. You can see, wow, for some reason Hulu's crushing it. We're getting a lot more activity out of that than we are out of Slinger or some of these others. But that is really more of general information, whereas the online stuff is exact. I got 750 visitors and of those, here's my breakdown of where they came from. They came from a directory or my Google, my business listing, or some other place on the way. No, no, no way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's the idea. And, like you know, you got to cast that wide net for that top of funnel. And when you talk to your one of the points you made earlier you're making a lot of great points. By the way, one of the points you mentioned is just, you know how you walk your clients through the process and try to get understanding when you're asking them, because you're not answering the phones, right. But hey, we're driving all these numbers, we're seeing all this data, we're seeing LIP, we're seeing some attribution. What's going, how's it going for you guys? Like, how's the sales team? Like, can we hop on a call with the sales team?
Speaker 1:And one of the things I like about that comment is in that direction. Rather, is that speaks to the importance of having a strategic partner in an agency. You know we both run agencies. I don't want to be referred to as just a vendor, you know I don't, and I don't think that speaks to what makes a successful engagement. Is that strategic partnership? And if you could, I mean you speak to a little bit more about how you guys are the strategic partner for your clients and, you know, looking out for them and planning for them and all that jazz.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's actually a really great question for this one, purbz, and I don't know how it is in your industry, but I get the feeling sometimes people don't want to tell us when we're doing too good for them, because they think we're just going to raise the price on them and what they have to understand in this I said so. I'll put this on the client that I'm not talking to, but maybe a potential client is the more information you can feed us, the better we can do for you. Now, if you go back 20 years ago and I'll speak specifically to legal marketing, because that's really my expertise you had two options to advertise TV and yellow pages. Okay, that was simple. You saw your yellow page rep once a year, signed a big check and they'd come back in a year. It is so much more complex now and the tools that you have access to and the levers and buttons you can push are so many that I need your feedback.
Speaker 2:I need to know when you're having a good week, because I want to say I know what I did this week or I want to track that back to your success and I want to double down on that somewhere else.
Speaker 2:And another practice area, another geography you're trying to break into. So I need to know when I'm not doing a good job, when the phones are cold. But I also need to know when the phones start ringing with qualified calls. Now, just because you didn't sign them up as a client doesn't mean it wasn't a good call if it was a case that you wanted. So it's a great question and I love that consultative side of what we do. I do consider myself an expert in this field because I've been in it so long. I don't feel like there's any marketing conversation in the legal aspect that I can't hang with. Not that I know everything, but I just know the industry well enough to be able to give good advice to people, and the more forthcoming somebody is a law firm is with what's working, what's not, the better resource we can be to them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a great point and, honestly, the consultative aspect of what we do with our respective clients and respective fields and all that stuff is I have learned more and more the most fun part about what we do. It's a perpetual trust building exercise. It's perpetual and ongoing creative exploration and problem solving. That's where the juice is, so to speak. That's really where those good ideas come from. It doesn't come from us in a boardroom and a creative bubble. I got it. I got that Don Draper campaign. That's not how the world works anymore.
Speaker 1:It did your point when it was all TV ads, bus stop signs and yellow page ads. You had that full page spread in the New York Times Fantastic. What have you done for me lately? I don't know. I geek out on this stuff because it's so much fun to get into and try new platforms, the OTT, the connected TV, all that stuff. It's been around for a while but it's maturing every day.
Speaker 1:As you pointed out earlier too, people are cutting the cord, so to speak. Every month it's more and more and more. It doesn't speak to necessarily one bucket or the other. What it does speak to is the diversification and continuing of that diversification of how do you split up the marketing pie every month that it fluctuates. Clients want us to tell them what is our media spending going to be in six months. I don't mean budget, budget is the budget, but where are we going to be allocating those funds? The honest to God truth is I don't know, we'll see, as it depends on all the market shifts and reacts to either content we're putting out there, their own market, their presence, what their target audience is feeling, all those little nuances. That's part of why we are valuable in our respective fields. My crystal ball only works so well.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, you don't want to be the blockbuster video of your industry. I know that X was working for you for the last 20 years. But you said it perfectly the diversification whether that's social media or connected TV or some other doing podcasts, getting your name out there. If you do what you've been doing for the last 20 years and you don't see this explosive growth in mediums that are all competing for our attention, they're all competing for our eyeballs. One quick analogy I'll give is I tell people this all the time You've got two McDonald's one has a drive-through, one doesn't Drive-through.
Speaker 2:Business may only be 20 percent of that McDonald's that has a drive-through, but if you don't have that drive-through, you will never get that business because you're looking at two different audiences. One person is on a rush. They don't want to get out of their car. The same thing would be true for people who wave off Instagram or Facebook or some other medium. They'll say, oh, that's not for me. No one's getting cases there. I can tell you with absolute certitude people are and you're not. Because you're not there, you don't have a drive-through, so you're not going to get that business.
Speaker 1:I love that analogy, that is, it's so simplistic, but it speaks volumes to the importance of the diversification of your marketing mix, that ever-evolving pie chart of where's your media spend going.
Speaker 1:Attention is attention. You either want the clients or you don't, and obviously you can't be all things to all people. That's either risk you run of trying to be everywhere all at once. But again, the beauty of having the data and the tools that we're speaking to in this conversation. It's still just another slice of the pie, but at least it gives us the demo data and we can be a bit more laser focused than we could have been 20, 30, 40, 50 years ago, even 10 years ago.
Speaker 1:I mean, we've gone leaps and bounds compared to where we were and what we had as marketers and as businesses. All right, so, eric, we covered a lot of ground here. You and I were talking a bit before about focus groups and now that's kind of a new direction for you to be able to get some really good feedback for your clients and their businesses, things that you maybe wouldn't have heard otherwise, that maybe are influencing some of the creative direction and marketing directions demographic targeting, data, all that jazz. How are you guys leveraging focus groups, and how is that working for you and your clients?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so for just about every new client that we bring on, we will run a focus group in their market and we'll normally ask them who they consider their biggest competitors to be. But then we'll always do our own research and find out who their online competitors are. So in the legal world, there's people who they feel are their competition based on trial skill, but they might not be online, they might not be advertising. So I want to take their three or four biggest competitors and run a focus group to see how is their messaging, does it compare? And we ask really direct questions to these focus groups, like who would you call first? Who wouldn't you call at all? Who would make your list? Why would you call them first? And then, as they go through these websites in real time, we want them to talk their way through it.
Speaker 2:Oh, I do like this, I don't like this, and I learn something every time because these are recorded. I'll go back and listen to them and I pick up something on every single one. So, as a business owner, running a focus group against you and your competitors I think is invaluable information that you'll be able to use for you know, perpetuity on how that messaging is being received by the people that you want to reach most.
Speaker 1:That's pretty exciting. I have to argue, I have not had much experience with the focus group stuff, at least with TAVA. We've done a lot of it at other agencies that I've worked at and I agree, I mean the amount of information you get from folks in, you know, among different demographic groups and some of the pain points that they experience are so, so, so valuable. And you know we've used focus groups in the past to, you know, get their feedback on. You know, certain ads that we've already produced and I think what you're uncovering is, before we even put into paper, on copy, what problem are we trying to solve for them? You know, and getting that information and that qualitative data, some of those nuggets and those talking points that inevitably are going to help not just influence your creative but also help solve their problem, because at the end of the day, we're not just trying to sell products and sell services and all that it really is trying to provide.
Speaker 1:You know, I don't make this more grandiose that it needs to be, but what is the greater good? You know, and you know, john, trying to sell ice to an Eskimo, can you still say that? I don't know, leave it. It's an old adage, you know, but it's. What is the, what is the pain point? What is the problem we're trying to solve? So, eric, how can folks get ahold of you and market my market?
Speaker 2:Sure, anybody who wants to reach directly out to me. It's my first name, eric E-R-I-C at marketmymarketcom Website is the same ending there marketmymarketcom. I'm always happy to talk to people. It's Eric Bersano on LinkedIn. Please link in connect with me. I'm always happy to share information or set up calls to chat with people about any and all things marketing.
Speaker 1:Awesome, eric. Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it, and thank you all for listening to the Creative Business Forum. We'll see you in the next episode.
